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Bible Questions and Spiritual Discussion
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TRWord
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06/19/2011 09:36 |
Craig from Illinois wrote:
After reading and reading this thread and others on similar topics I have concluded that it would take a PhD in your theology to be saved. And even with a PhD, I would still need to be elect to grasp the mysteries. Since that runs contrary to every biblical salvation story, parable and teaching, I have to conclude that your theology is false.
What do you have to say to this?
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No PhD is required but a childlike faith in the word of the Lord is.
Matt. 18:2 And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them,
Matt. 18:3 And said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven.
Matt. 18:4 Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.
The way to life is not a given, it’s a quest that requires our utmost desire and a single mindedness of purpose.
He taught that we must be motivated by the quest for truth more than the desire to protect tradition and old doctrines if we are to ever grasp this new understanding.
Mark 7:7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Mark 7:8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
Notice He is saying that it’s possible to worship Him in vain.
The common understanding is that we seek our way in the world while we serve God on the side. But Jesus taught that we are a product of our desire. Our utmost desire is what we treasure most, therefore our likelihood of finding the way to life is equivalent to our desire to find it.
He said; “strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.”
And He reinforced this statement by saying;
Matt. 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Matt. 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
These words obviously are not spoken of nonbelievers and atheists but of those who choose to followed doctrine and not His teaching only to discover that they are lost.
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Craig from Illinois
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06/19/2011 10:20 |
And what about Grace?
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Ray
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06/19/2011 14:25 |
Tom's church, the meeting house, has a podcast series called "Duped" which covers the new age teachers. You can find it here under 2009:
http://www.themeetinghouse.ca/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=121
or on under itunes, The Meeting House AudioCast. To be clear, the teacher says point blank, that he is NOT saying the the new age teachers such as Chopra, Tolle, and the others are duped and that we are not. He is saying that all people who think they know it all are duped in their arrogance and that we can learn from each other. I'm hearing much of that here from many. You guys have a history which I've still not read completely (get to it, Ray).
TRW may not be preaching your cup of tea, but he is available, and therefore valuable. We have a lot to learn from him and he from us. I know and love people that follow the new age teachings. I desire TRW to teach me about their ways so I can lead people to the Lord. We don't have to agree and accept new age thinking, but don't be threatened by it. It won't go away, so you better learn and be thankful for the opportunity. You never know when the Spirit may need you to speak to someone about it. We can always learn. Laughing at and rejecting people is not the way to get the job done.
Lets' face it, the christian church has a rich history of being duped. If you look at what Jesus taught as opposed to what the church has done there are big problems. It's one of the reasons Oprah and Co. are doing so well. We need to out-Jesus the new age in a big way. I'm not saying that they have a corner on the truth. I'm saying all people, prostitutes, thieves, church goers, and new agers all have much to be humble about and I'm not seeing that here.
Let me start with a bit of humble. Andre, I have a public apology to make. I did to you exactly what TRW did to me. Once, Andre asked me a question and I was in no mood for it so I just ignored it. I regret doing that and I apologize, Andre. It was disrespectful. You asked me if I was a Catholic. At the time, I was going through some rough times about religion. I really hated what religion has done to so many people I met. I was pretty angry about it, but that had nothing to do with you. I just took it out on you. I hurt nobody but myself. You probably don't remember, but I knew as soon as I did it, it was sin. The timing of the question was just bad (from my POV) and my attitude was even worse. I'm not a Catholic. I really think religion is dead and serves no purpose. Jesus ended the need for religion. He's alive. He is our all-in-all. I go to a baptist church so I can tell people about the lover of our souls as often as I can. I get to teach all kinds of classes. Not because I'm a gifted teacher or anything. It's mostly because everyone else defers. They are either to lazy or interested in other things to take the time. I'm trying to make the fellowship I share in a party, celebrating the most monumental event of all history. Superbowl party, New Years Eve, how stupid is that? Jesus is risen. Now that's something to celebrate! That's why people should gather together. To many people are duped into religion having power to save. Those days are over. It is for freedom that Christ has set us free.
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Ray
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06/19/2011 14:39 |
"...the Holy Ghost is the only One in the true position to criticize, He alone is able to show what is wrong without hurting and wounding. It is impossible to enter into communion with God when you are in a critical temper; it makes you hard and vindictive and cruel, and leaves you with the flattering unction that you are a superior person."
http://www.myutmost.org/06/0617.html
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John T
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06/19/2011 20:42 |
I was listening to "The Next Story" download today more while driving. A very interesting listen. The topic today was about speaking the truth in love and it made me realize that perhaps that needed to be done here. I agree with the post above that there is much false information being spread. The Bible talks about the battle between good and evil. It speaks of the final defeat of evil, it speaks of the armour and preparations that we must take, it speaks of sin, it speaks of good. TRWord, you define sin as a belief and Satan and angels good and evil as non-existant. I'm not sure how to speak the truth as lovingly as possible here - this is false. This is exactly a tactic that Satan would like us to believe that he does not exist. Even Jesus was tempted in the desert. We are created with a conscience and know when we have done wrong, we feel guilt, we know our need for our savior Jesus Christ. A belief that says good and evil do not exist is false, plain and simple. We need to learn how to battle, how to live in a war-time mentality, on guard and prepared and ready to face what the Bible teaches is out there, and to live victoriously for Christ. If your country was being invaded by foreign soldiers, it would not be profitable to discuss the idea that they don't exist. You could be beaten and killed by what you profess doesn't exist. Let's stop converting threads all over this forum to this debate.
That's my two Canadian cents.
Thanks for your time,
John
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TRWord
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06/20/2011 03:56 |
Craig from Illinois wrote:
And what about Grace?
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The grace of God is obtained only through the knowledge of the Holy Ghost.
Prov. 9:10 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.
The change from the old covenant “the fear of the Lord” to grace “the knowledge of the holy spirit” requires a break from our previous understanding and faith in the word of Lord Jesus Christ.
Paul said it this way:
Rom. 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
In our quest for the truth we have to have the courage to go against the majority belief and stand alone if we have to.
2 Cor. 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
2 Cor. 6:18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.
It’s impossible for any true seeker not to recognize that the message is in the word of the Lord.
John 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.
John 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.
God’s plan of salvation was first given to the Jews.
John 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
But most of them did not believe. Jesus promised to those who believe.
John 8:31 Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
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Catholica
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06/20/2011 06:07 |
So TRWord, with regard to "heavenly places" in Ephesians 1:3, would you say that heaven is not a place, but a state of pure belief in only good, and no evil?
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TRWord
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06/20/2011 06:14 |
Ray wrote;
Let me start with a bit of humble. Andre, I have a public apology to make. I did to you exactly what TRW did to me. Once, Andre asked me a question and I was in no mood for it so I just ignored it.
================================================
Ray I’m sorry for ignoring your question. I got carried away in showing the differences in the many versions of the scripture which makes it difficult for us to have a real common ground and in so doing I didn’t get back to your question.
You asked;
How is our need of armor explained in the model?
Whether the individual believes as I do that God admonished Adam against the belief in good and evil from the very beginning.
Gen. 2:17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
Or he believes that the devil was defeated at calvary.
John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
It’s time for Christians to stop giving the devil such authority in their beliefs.
Eph. 6:11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
The whole armor of God is the realization of the omnipotence of God.
Rev. 19:6 And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth.
Or the realization that the devil has no power and all power is unto God.
James said it this way:
James 4:7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
Now many have had difficulty with what they thought is a contradiction where James tells us to resist the devil and Jesus told us to resist not evil.
Matt. 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
To me there is no contradiction here. By resisting evil we affirm it’s existence so Jesus commanded us against it. But by resisting the belief in the devil we affirm the truth of the omnipotence of God.
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Catholica
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06/20/2011 06:48 |
Hi Ray,
Thank you for your apology. To tell the truth, I had completely forgot anything negative that you wrote in the past, and have had absolutely no ill feelings toward you, and I appreciate your insight here on the forum. You are forgiven, naturally!
Andre
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TRWord
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06/20/2011 09:42 |
Andre wrote:
So TRWord, with regard to "heavenly places" in Ephesians 1:3, would you say that heaven is not a place, but a state of pure belief in only good, and no evil?
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In the very first verse of the Bible we are told that God created two realms the spiritual realm “heaven” and the material realm “earth.”
Gen. 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
The Bible further emphasize this by making the clear distinction between “the heaven and the earth” and “the heavens and the earth.”
Gen. 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Jesus also taught that heaven was the realm of our Father.
Matt. 6:9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy
name.
And He emphasized that it’s not a material place when He said it’s not “Lo here! or, lo there!” but the spiritual realm which we access from within.
Luke 17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
Luke 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
To understand “the heavenly places” that Paul is referring to throughout his letter to the Ephesians.
Eph. 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
We have to first understand what Jesus called the key to the kingdom.
Matt. 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
The revelation here is; that we are the ones who assign power and authority either to the things of the earth or to Our Father which is heaven.
Paul is saying that all our spiritual blessings are in heavenly places in Christ: Or that we should look to heaven in all matters.
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